what everyones view on suicide?

[Acromnion]

just though it'd be an interesting topic/debate:P

[Amazonis]

I have no problems with suicide. If somedody wants to end their own life, thats none of my buissiness. If someone is fealing more negatives than positives in life, then death is the best solution to their problems. In death you cannot feal any emotions, so therefore if your life was shit death can only be an improvement. Also, whats the point of another human staying alive, using up vast quantaties of resources, when they would rather be dead anyway!?

[Evil_Mage_Ra]

I think it's a pretty selfish and desperate act. It's a horrible strain on your loved ones. Imagine if one of your loved ones commit suicide out of the blue.......If anyone here's considering suicide, PLEASE seek help.

On the other hand, if you're talking about euthanasia, and death is imminent anyway, I don't see any reason why a person shouldn't be able to end their suffering. Since it's scheduled, family and friends will be able to say their final good-byes.

[ghoulslime]

I almost did myself in back in 1997. If anyone is thinking about it - don't. You have one chance to experience all that you can. It took BILLIONS of years for you to come in to being. YOU can never be again. Don't squander a second. When the time comes that I am so diseased and worn-out that life holds absolutely nothing more for me, when I have squeezed out every drop of meaning, sucked all the marrow, then I will eat a bullet and go to meet oblivion. But until then, Ghoulslime lives it up!


Dictate Of Oblivion

O dictate of oblivion, master of eternal never,
Almighty judge, omnipotent magnate,
Damn my wretched being to fate -
This existence expiring in a rush towards forever.
Blind are my eyes to all but your face.
I await your dreadful kiss,
Your utter embrace -
Precarious my soul, resigned to totter at the edge of the abyss!

~ Daniel F Mitchell

www.poetryring.com

[GodlessHeathen]

In general, I feel that suicide is a permanent solution to temporary problems. As Evil_Mage said, it's a desperate act, and anyone contemplating it should seek help.

On the other hand, if you're talking about euthanasia, and death is imminent anyway, I don't see any reason why a person shouldn't be able to end their suffering. Since it's scheduled, family and friends will be able to say their final good-byes.
I also agree with this.

[Amazonis]

I think it's a pretty selfish and desperate act. It's a horrible strain on your loved ones. Imagine if one of your loved ones commit suicide out of the blue.......If anyone here's considering suicide, PLEASE seek help.
It's not the family's choice. If they can't accept the persons choice then they are the selfish ones.

[ghoulslime]

I think it's a pretty selfish and desperate act. It's a horrible strain on your loved ones. Imagine if one of your loved ones commit suicide out of the blue.......If anyone here's considering suicide, PLEASE seek help.
It's not the family's choice. If they can't accept the persons choice then they are the selfish ones.
I beg to differ on this one, dear Amazonis. In theory, that sounds solid. In practice there are often many unintended effects.

Years back, the father of one of my students in Korea poured fuel oil over his sleeping family and lit them on fire. He then hanged himself from the doorknob with a belt. Ghoulslime was the lucky bastard who got to find them. I think his idea was to spare his family the grief of his suicide.

Another of my students decided to jump off the 11th floor of her apartment building - while Ghoulslime and her friends looked on.

While I can sympathize with their pain and misery, I really wish they hadn't done it. They caused a lot of people a lot of hurt. :(

[Amazonis]

I don't encourage suicide, however if i was a family member of somebody who committed suicide, i would accept their choice. If someone i knew was going to kill themselves, i would strongly discourage it, but i would not forcefully bully them into continuing a life of misery just so i wouldn't have to see them die.

[Spurius Furius]

I don't encourage suicide, however if i was a family member of somebody who committed suicide, i would accept their choice. If someone i knew was going to kill themselves, i would strongly discourage it, but i would not forcefully bully them into continuing a life of misery just so i wouldn't have to see them die.
Not me. If I were the family member, I would continually be haunted by the notion that I did not do enough to help them or notice that they had a problem. For me this is not a question of respecting choice, it is always a terrible failure.

[schemanista]

Not me. If I were the family member, I would continually be haunted by the notion that I did not do enough to help them or notice that they had a problem. For me this is not a question of respecting choice, it is always a terrible failure.
And that's the terrible collateral damage that suicide causes. You might spend the rest of your life torturing yourself about something you couldn't change. If someone close to you decides to commit suicide, short of stopping him in the act (and he can always try again), there really is nothing you can do about it. The "survivor guilt" that you experience is as natural as it is fallacious.

[CFett]

I don't understand the hypocracy of saying suicide is selfish. Being selfish doesn't apply to someone's own life or death. Suggesting someone should keep living because it's better for others is pretty damn selfish.
Telling somone that whatever their feeling is only temporary and that they shouldn't commit suicide because it will harm others, kind of acts to reinforce to this person how blind people around them are to their plight, and how they don't truly care about the individual. They're more interested in avoiding their own hurt, not the actual suffering person.
Saying suicide is selfish is the apologist, blameless society answer.
So people are supposed to ignore what's happening inside of them, so everyone around them can benefit from the good they see in them.
Death causes hurt. That's how it goes. But is your temporary (or long lasting hurt) worth more than the hurt of the sufferer?
Suicide is as subjective as everything else in life.

[Evil_Mage_Ra]

I don't understand the hypocracy of saying suicide is selfish. Being selfish doesn't apply to someone's own life or death. Suggesting someone should keep living because it's better for others is pretty damn selfish.
Telling somone that whatever their feeling is only temporary and that they shouldn't commit suicide because it will harm others, kind of acts to reinforce to this person how blind people around them are to their plight, and how they don't truly care about the individual. They're more interested in avoiding their own hurt, not the actual suffering person.
Saying suicide is selfish is the apologist, blameless society answer.
So people are supposed to ignore what's happening inside of them, so everyone around them can benefit from the good they see in them.
Death causes hurt. That's how it goes. But is your temporary (or long lasting hurt) worth more than the hurt of the sufferer?
Suicide is as subjective as everything else in life.
I would call an act that is motivated by self-pity and that causes tremendous grief to others selfish, especially when there are alternatives available. As someone who has had borderline-suicidal friends, I know it is untrue that people around them are "blind to their plight". People *want* to help. The difficulty is in getting a suicidal person as interested in their own survival as their family and friends are.

[GodlessHeathen]

I don't understand the hypocracy of saying suicide is selfish. Being selfish doesn't apply to someone's own life or death. Suggesting someone should keep living because it's better for others is pretty damn selfish.
Telling somone that whatever their feeling is only temporary and that they shouldn't commit suicide because it will harm others, kind of acts to reinforce to this person how blind people around them are to their plight, and how they don't truly care about the individual. They're more interested in avoiding their own hurt, not the actual suffering person.
Saying suicide is selfish is the apologist, blameless society answer.
So people are supposed to ignore what's happening inside of them, so everyone around them can benefit from the good they see in them.
Death causes hurt. That's how it goes. But is your temporary (or long lasting hurt) worth more than the hurt of the sufferer?
Suicide is as subjective as everything else in life.
Actually, I don't agree that it is selfish. I went through a period in 1995 where my life was a shit sandwich, and I almost did it myself. During that time, I didn't (and I still don't) understand why it's considered selfish. But, that's just me.

However, I do think it is short-sighted and stupid. All of the issues and problems that were making my day-to-day life such a struggle got resolved, and my life started getting better within a year. If I had taken my own life, I would've missed out on a lot.

[ocmpoma]

"...suicide is a permanent solution to temporary problems."
That was the line fed to us in 'suicide prevention training'. Stupid Navy. Anyone out there interested in temporary solutions?

Anyway, from a less emotional standpoint - suicide involves expense to the community at large (police, emt, etc. etc.) So, I think it should be highly discouraged (legally) for those reasons. As for the emotional harm it causes others, that's a whole 'nother ball game.

[openly68atheist]

If I was in Christopher Reeves situation I would instantly kill my-self, I don't think even in my life that the religious extremist will allow for the necesseray research to cure paralysis.

[GodlessHeathen]

"...suicide is a permanent solution to temporary problems."
That was the line fed to us in 'suicide prevention training'. Stupid Navy. Anyone out there interested in temporary solutions?
I agree, it sounds like a platitude. But I know from experience that that tends to be the case.

[HMS Beagle]

I toyed with suicide once, and it would have been easy because vascular surgery had created an artery that bulged like a thin snake just under the skin on my forearm. It was actually hard to stop the heavy arterial blood flow from hypodermic punctures, so a minor cut would have bled me out pretty fast. But my body refused to act, and when your body makes a decision, you're rarely in a position to argue. The thing is, I was plenty sick, but I wasn't depressed (http://www.ohsuhealth.com/htaz/mental/statistics.cfm).

I agree with John Hockenberry: Suicide is something you talk yourself out of, not into.

[Trublu]

Another one here who's considered it. There are different circumstances for everything and I wouldn't want to make a sweeping generalisation with this, but my reason for not going further was that it would have been unforgiveably selfish.

I thought about the impact the non-suicidal death of a school colleague, someone I barely knew, had had on me. Then I thought about all the people who knew him better - school friends, other friends, parents, siblings, grandparents aunt and uncles, cousins, even teachers and neighbours. I thought about how for me and other casual acquaintances the sadness would disappear quickly, but for closer friends it would be more intense and lasy much longer, and for close family it would be very intense and would never go away. I thought about how his parents who had invested 16 years of their lives and 16 years of love in him would forever, until their dying breath, feel empty, feel something was missing, feel unfulfilled in life. I thought about this vast volume of accumulated long-term misery; how it would be, in some ways, even worse with the death being a voluntary deliberate act, and I thought that it soared high above the pain an individual was even capable of suffering. I thought that, whilst it would relieve my pain, it would cause such more pain in so many other people that I cared about, that it would be a horribly selfish act, a disgraceful thing to do to my family who loved me and supported me so much.

And that if I just waited until morning, I could always re-consider.

I felt much better in the morning.

[Just Add Fire]

the whole idea of suicide does not bother me at all...unless i were the one responsible for cleaning it up...so...dont put a gun in your mouth...put a bottle of pills

[SenorChristPuncher]

what the hell if a family member can't understand the amount of pain you are going through and want you endure it just so they don't feel bad its being purely selfish on their part. however, most people who contemplate suicide and decline will tell you they were thinking in an extremely myopic manner.

[AtheistFreedom]

I almost did myself in back in 1997. If anyone is thinking about it - don't. You have one chance to experience all that you can. It took BILLIONS of years for you to come in to being. YOU can never be again. Don't squander a second. When the time comes that I am so diseased and worn-out that life holds absolutely nothing more for me, when I have squeezed out every drop of meaning, sucked all the marrow, then I will eat a bullet and go to meet oblivion. But until then, Ghoulslime lives it up!
I find that terribly ironic, considering that was the same year I almost did it too. I was just a month shy from graduating high-school, and when I think of what I've experienced in the eight years since that never would've happened, and all that is yet to come regardless of how much longer (or not) I live, it's always worth sticking around for the good parts, even if they admittedly are only brief punctuations on the otherwise shitty landscape of human existence.

Besides, look at it this way, once you're gone, you'll never have to deal with the bad shit again, EVER. So why not at least stick it out and try your damnedest to make up for the bad with as much joy and happiness as you can possibly manage?

Look, I'm not some hypocrite trying to say that 'life' has any intrinsic value, because it really doesn't, but when it's the only one you'll ever have, I find it insane to be in such a hurry to meet with eternal annihilation.

That's all for now.

[Dan Bukszpan]

My view on suicide is that more christians should do it.

[peepnklown]

In general, I feel that suicide is a permanent solution to temporary problems. As Evil_Mage said, it's a desperate act, and anyone contemplating it should seek help.
Human life is temporary compared to the universe.

[Kamikaze189]

Just a note: I was once suicidal as most of you seem to have been.

I think suicide is actually ok. I almost want to say that it should be encouraged. If you are so weak as to end your own life, then that's fine by me. If you overcome the hard times, it'll make you stronger.

As for the whole "family" issue, make your own choice there. When I was suicidal, my "family" was busy rejecting me for my challenging of religion, and they didn't cross my mind.

[nolageek]

I think what a lot of you are missing is that many times the suicidal person is suffering from real, clinical depression, not some unalterable life situation. I don't think it's selfish, and I don't think it's an answer in most situations. Now if you were in a burning tower... say... the world trade center... I could understand the rationale, but if someone commits suicide because they lose their job, or their girlfriend left them - it's clearly a case of something else going on... probably some mental imbalance.

Really. For people so quick to judge using logic and science, you certainly miss the boat on this. I take it no one you all have known has suffered from Depression or is BiPolar - you'll know what I mean by irrational thinking.. it's worse than most christians I know. :)

And, for the record - to answer the OT and then some: I think suicide is stupid, unless you are in a situation where it's the better way of exiting stage left, I'm all for euthanasia for the terminally ill. I'm (personally) against abortion but I don't think it's really up to me so I'm pro choice, I'm against the death penalty, blah blah blah

[snap crafter]

Well, if your a christian I say to send yourself to god right now to save, not only the time and troubles you may experience in the future, but the annoyance you would cause others by 'bible-thumpin'. If your life sucks so bad that death is good for you, I'm glad, if your a whiner that's just doing it to get attention, I hope you screw up and die by accident. Course I don't mean 'cutters' that's a whole other category.

[Rhinoqulous]

Suicide is a tricky subject. I've had three people close to me commit suicide, two friends and a cousin, and none for a good reason. My cousin committed suicide when the girl he had been dating for 7 years dumped him after he proposed to her; he believed he couldn't live without her, and took a shotgun to the head. One friend was bi-polar, and overdosed on pills. My other friend was, lets say a bit odd, and lived with an abusive grandfather. One night in a drunken rage, he shot his grandfather, and then in remorse, turned the gun on himself. I think all of these people could have been helped, and suicide was a permanent solution to their temporary problems (I know, I'm sounding like an after school special).

I do support suicide for people in chronic pain, incurable diseases and such. I just think most suicides are for reasons much more trivial than that.

Rhinoq

[MrsMoe]

A suicidal person does not stop to say: "Hey, maybe I shouldn't do this, my family loves me! Na, I am going to end my life for me me me, because I want to damn it, screw my family!" If a suicidal person was mentally clear enough to reason in this way, they aren't suicidal in the first place.

It's not about going shoe shopping, it's about taking your own life, that's some pretty serious shit. Suicide is the act of desperation. Your life is so very difficult or horrid that it is no longer worth living. My mother commited suicide, and while I wish she hadn't done it, I would never judge her or call her selfish. She was sick.

I of course disagree with "emotional" suicide unless a person is terminally ill or so severely disabled that life is not worth bothering with (Christopher Reeves - I wouldn't want to live that way. I would not want to be bound to a bed as a vegetable the rest of my life either.)

I think if we can put a suffering dog to sleep, we should be able to make the choice over our own bodies to have physician assisted suicide in cases like terminal cancer etc.

[nolageek]

I don't think suicide is always about ending a life that is so horrid or no longer worth living. Many times it's an altered perception of one's situation from drugs or mental illness. Clinical depression is a bitch. :/

[mud]

Euthanasia-yes.
Suicide-no.
I figure if you're well enough to be able to end your life,your well enough to live through it.

[RedRob]

I’ve had one friend commit suicide and two attempted to do the same and I have to say that none of them were selfish but were in fact mentally unstable. My friend that succeeded was not visibly suicidal although he did give some clues that seem obvious now but were not so obvious before it happened. I’m afraid that this is usually the case with people that attempt suicide. I think that these people need help and should not be judged by anyone who is in good mental health. Depression is a sickness and in fact a chemical malfunction of our brains that prevents us from coping with “bad” things in our life.

Many people don’t see it this way and I’m afraid that religions were just not designed to deal with issues of mental health in a proper manner. We are after all talking about the same people that think that a schizophrenic or any other mentally ill person is possessed by the devil.

[psyadam]

People who want to die are not crazy. They just have financial difficulties usually.

[Kamikaze189]

I heard (I am in no way going to try to defend this or present it as factual, just hearsay) that the irs is responsible for something like 65% of suicides.

[Tenspace]

I heard (I am in no way going to try to defend this or present it as factual, just hearsay) that the irs is responsible for something like 65% of suicides.
Wow. I'd find that hard to believe. K, this is a good chance to brush up on your research skills. Search the web, check out snopes.com, etc. Maybe you can find something to substantiate or refute those numbers, and share them with us.


Tenspace

[MrsMoe]

The IRS is evil. They owe me nearly 3K on a tax return and gave me only $121.00 on accident. I contacted them, they agreed it was owed, told me to send statement in writing. I have sent 3 statements over the course of a year and still not a word.


http://www.neo-tech.com/irs-class-action/1.html

[Nicole]

In the last 45 years suicide has increased 60% world wide. It's the third leading cause of death of young people and the eighth overall in the US. http://www.befrienders.org/suicide/statistics.htm

I have a suspicion that it's connected to our societies' preocupation with 'me me me'. We seem to spend an incredible amount of time thinking about ourselves and our problems. It blinds us to the world and it's possibilities.

I guess I'm fairly unusual in that I've never thought about suicide...to much natural dopamine I guess. With the exception of people that have some imbalance or something, I really think that most people just get wrapped up in their own problems and can't find a way out. In that respect suicide is selfish.

Whenever I think my life sucks I just remind myself that I was lucky enough to be born in a time with running water, womens' rights and internet porn.

[KingExamin]

I've faced suicide before, but then I thought... I just need to grow up. I had a couple of shitty days, get over it. Suicide is just a act of maturity. If you think by killing yourself will end it all, do it. Instead of fixing yourlife, you just fucked someone elses up. Good job jackass, atleast someone is happy.

[snap crafter]

In the last 45 years suicide has increased 60% world wide. It's the third leading cause of death of young people and the eighth overall in the US. http://www.befrienders.org/suicide/statistics.htm

I have a suspicion that it's connected to our societies' preocupation with 'me me me'. We seem to spend an incredible amount of time thinking about ourselves and our problems. It blinds us to the world and it's possibilities.

I guess I'm fairly unusual in that I've never thought about suicide...to much natural dopamine I guess. With the exception of people that have some imbalance or something, I really think that most people just get wrapped up in their own problems and can't find a way out. In that respect suicide is selfish.

Whenever I think my life sucks I just remind myself that I was lucky enough to be born in a time with running water, womens' rights and internet porn.
I hate to disagree, but I wouldn't put women's rights and internet porn in the same category, like an apple and a golden apple.

[Nicole]

Whenever I think my life sucks I just remind myself that I was lucky enough to be born in a time with running water, womens' rights and internet porn.
I hate to disagree, but I wouldn't put women's rights and internet porn in the same category, like an apple and a golden apple.
Ah Snap...I'm so impressed that you view womens' rights so highly elevated above porn. You are really a great guy. :D

[snap crafter]

Hubbawha? women's rights is to internet porn, as an apple is to a golden apple? I don't know about you, but I'd rather have me a golden apple.

[KingExamin]

Hubbawha? women's rights is to internet porn, as an apple is to a golden apple? I don't know about you, but I'd rather have me a golden apple.
Well... I don't know now... :D

[suttsteve]

If people realize that they're ending their existence and that they won't ever exist again, then it should be their decision. If they think that they're going to live on after they kill themselves, then they need to consider the possibility that they're not, before they do something that can't be undone.

[Downslide]

well... my view is pretty simple: if you're a Theist, then you know that suicide is a no-no to your god(dess)(e)(s) or system of belief... so that's a non sequitur.

as for the Atheist, well - you've only got one kick at the cat... but it's really an individual choice: I'd never do it.

[calpurnpiso]

People who want to die are not crazy. They just have financial difficulties usually.
..or they are anxious to go see God, and enjoy his kingdom for ever and ever..:)

[TroggleHumper]

Im for it.

[RedRob]

People who want to die are not crazy. They just have financial difficulties usually.
Nice to see people pull shit out of their ass and the rest of you agree with it. Non of my friends had financial difficulties, they were sick and given that most of you agree with this dumb statement.... atheists more intelligent I'm not so sure after reading this thread. Maybe I just don’t see this as funny as the rest of you since I’ve witnessed it up close perhaps one day you will understand.:|

[Nicole]

People who want to die are not crazy. They just have financial difficulties usually.
Nice to see people pull shit out of their ass and the rest of you agree with it. Non of my friends had financial difficulties, they were sick and given that most of you agree with this dumb statement.... atheists more intelligent I'm not so sure after reading this thread. Maybe I just don’t see this as funny as the rest of you since I’ve witnessed it up close perhaps one day you will understand.:|
I didn't most people agreeing with this statement. I personally think that the statement is false. I also think that some people deal with uncomfortable topics by making light of them so I'm sure that no one was trying to diminish your friends' lives with their comments.

[Tenspace]

People who want to die are not crazy. They just have financial difficulties usually.
Nice to see people pull shit out of their ass and the rest of you agree with it.
Add me to the list of those that didn't agree with the original statement but have been grouped in agreement because I maintained silence on the subject. No, wait, I questioned Kamikaze about his facts regarding 65% of suicides are blamed on the IRS.

My take on the original comment is that it was uninformed and hasty - I personally didn't think it would warrant a followup.

If it's such a big issue, Rob, why didn't you respond to it?

Ten

[RedRob]

I apologize for my pervious post, only some of you agreed with it. I think I'm just taking this too personally. I'll move on to other threads and once again I apologize for my generalization.

[psyadam]

I said that because that was a hypothesis that I wanted to make and see if people agreed with it. It wasn't based on anything. Personally I often feel like I want to die after I think about problems related to that and it's the only thing that ever gets me on that train of thought.

[Stop the Robots]

I have no respect for those who commit suicide.

[Another brick in the wall]

I reccomend it for people that irritate me.

[Stop the Robots]

I have no respect for those who commit suicide.
What about some old man with no family and terminal bowel cancer? Should he suffer the ultimate pain in the ass and spend his last days in constant pain? Suicide is selfish, but so is driving a massive SUV. It's those bastards who jump in front of trains and make everyone late that don't deserve any respect.
Are we talking about assisted suicide? I guess I mean people that don't have a good reason to. Like, the only person I know that has done it was a total jerk and tortured his family, I was glad to see him go.

[Wiredrawn]

Just watch a sensitive topic go down the crapper. Suicide is a personal choice. It's not for everyone but there are people out there who need to not be judged by such a choice. Death is considered the ultimate "evil" and the fact that some people bring it on themselves is beyond your realm of comprehension; however, that is in no way a reason to pass judgement.

[miata]

I live to irritate the right wing nuts