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Old 03-27-2018, 11:52 AM   #4098
Simon Moon
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 117
Andrew66 wrote View Post
Nope, nope, narrow minded... IQ only 5.
I am absolutely NOT narrow minded.

I am willing to believe anything for which demonstrable and falsifiable evidence, and valid and sound logic is presented.

There is one aspect only which could be argued as circular with regards to the assertions made in the Bible, and that is

The written text in the Bible comprises the word of God - whereby the only evidence to this comes from the written text which states so.
And that is the most important aspect.

Where it the evidence EXTERNAL to the Bible which confirms any of the god and miracle claims in the Bible?

But firstly, just because "circular" that does not mean it aint true fool.
This is sort of true.

An invalid and unsound syllogism can have a true conclusion, but the conclusion was not derived from the flawed syllogism. It might be a lucky guess, or it might be known from other source.

If all one has is a flawed syllogism for their conclusion, there is no way to know if it is actually true.

One can't use flawed reasoning and guarantee they will reach a true conclusion. The conclusion is correct, despite the flawed logic.

Here is an example of a unsound syllogism with a true conclusion. The conclusion does not follow from the premises, yet it is still true.

(1) All humans are dogs. False

(2) Lassie is a human. False

(3) Lassie is a dog. True

Lets say hypothetically that by a miracle its true, yes.. The written text of the Bible truly is the Word of God, and part of that message is to let us know that.
Not sure I quite understand this...

But, even if a miracle in the Bible can be proven to be true, it does not follow logically, that the god claims must also be true. You are making an unsupported assertion that the only way to have miracles, is if a god exists. How did you eliminate the possibility of a person that is not a god, having magical powers?

Then even though you may think the concept is circular, in this hypothetical example it is true nontheless.

Therefore your complaint is worthless.
Logic is a tool used to tell if a conclusion is supported by the arguments. If one's logic is flawed, there is no way to tell if the conclusion is true.

Again, Muslims use circular logic, exactly the same way you are advocating here, and they reach a completely different conclusion (the truth of the Koan) than you do.

How am I, a person outside of BOTH religions, if all I am given is flawed logic, able to tell which one of you is correct?

And I don't even need to go to my second point, many of the other statements within the Bible are straightforward historical accounts - nothing circular about journalistic reporting.
Sure, there is no question that the Bible does contain SOME true historical accounts. So what? The Bible also contains a lot of historically inaccurate events, and events known not have happened. I can list them if you want...

How do some historical accurate accounts in the Bible give any credence to the supernatural god and miracle claims?

Homer's Iliad and Odyssey also mention real cities, people that actually existed, accounts of actual wars and battles, etc. Does that mean the god claims also contained in those texts are also true?

And by the way, do you know how the historically accurate accounts in the Bible were confirmed to be accurate?

By comparing them to other accounts external to the Bible. Historians do not believe any historical events are true just because they are in the Bible, they need to confirm them independently.
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