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Old 11-28-2019, 06:05 PM   #16
Smellyoldgit
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What if Socialism simply means "Shared Ownership"?
Then anything provided via taxation is Socialism.

Public highways & all associated infrastructure.
Police, fire & ambulance emergency services.
Public schools.
Utilities infrastructure - gas, water, electric, telecoms.
Drainage & wastewater/sewage treatment.
Public transportation - bus, rail & local metro services.
Public libraries
National, State & local Parks.
Medidaid, Medicare & the Veterans Affairs Hospitals - (because a huge percentage of the US population could never afford to buy unaided insurance in the current privatised system).
Social Security - (because millions can't afford to pay their way or eat, despite running three jobs.)
Waste & recycling facilities.
.... and of course, the majestic $750 Billion annual fee to provide the world's biggest killing & freedumb delivery service!


Obviously, the haters of Socialism wouldn't be seen dead touching any of these services ....

Stop the Holy See men!
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Old 11-28-2019, 06:28 PM   #17
Noodle
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Then again, there are some bad actors over on the far left, as well.
You wanna give some examples? Maybe we can start a fight. That's just what this forum needs.
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Old 11-28-2019, 08:30 PM   #18
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I've seen it in the news, where some guys were rioting against some alt-right rioters. Just because the alt-right guys are messed up in the head doesn't mean the left-ish guys need to be that way. Crazy is equal opportunity, I guess. If you want an argument, I'm not your person, btw. I'm too old to get worked up over much. Maybe a low-key discussion. Just know that I'm also not all that political, either.
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Old 11-28-2019, 09:08 PM   #19
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Oh, like Antifa. I thought you meant individuals on the left. Yeah, I'm not sure whether getting physical with neo-Nazis is really the way to go yet.

I'm not serious about getting into a fight. Although I must admit when we all agree with each other this forum is kind of a yawn.
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Old 11-29-2019, 01:17 AM   #20
hertz vanrental
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He would have gotten strung up for real, instead of only in effigy. Some of the far right actors in the US are concerning, to say the least. Then again, there are some bad actors over on the far left, as well.
Could do with some help if you could, please. My wife and I will be in San Francisco over the Christmas/New Year period. What kind of weather should we expect?

Do I sound like a fuckin' people person?
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Old 11-29-2019, 02:54 AM   #21
hertz vanrental
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Toiletpaper

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If socialism means workers control the means of production and/or everything is nationalized and the economy is planned rather than being a market, then I don't think I'm socialist because I think too many people are too dumb and lazy to do all that effectively. (And unregulated capitalism is just as bad.)

If it means the government does things then I guess I am socialist. Is it socialist to think businesses should generally be made to pay living wages?

I was thinking the other day about how many people are struggling in the US and how we can justify paying so little for the jobs we want done. For example, if the people who make burgers and fries at McDonald's can't be paid enough to live, I dare say we as a society can't afford burgers and fries from McDonald's.
In some ways, people are their own worst enemies.

Where I live, there's a lot of poverty. In some ways, it's self-inflicted. The busiest shops in the town are the charity shops where a lot of people buy their clothes, not because of a social conscience, but through necessity.

Parents can't afford to take a vacation during the school holidays because they are in low-paid jobs. Therefore, they take them during term time when the cost is much lower. School attendance, where I live, is one of the worst in the country.

The vacations are 'basic' and consist of camping or caravan holidays within a 50 mile radius or less. Again, this is through necessity and not out of a desire to reduce their carbon footprint.

The parents, in these parts, believe that their young children only 'play' at school and therefore don't believe that taking them out of school during term time has any affect whatsoever. The parents also believe that the older children will 'catch up' once they return to school. These myths were passed down to the parents from their parents. They are borne of ignorance and wishful thinking. The truth is that, through play, young children learn the skills and principals that will be needed to base more formal learning on. Also, research shows that children that miss lessons, generally, don't 'catch up'. In fact, as time goes by, they fall further and further behind. These children tend to leave school at the earliest opportunity and with few, if any, qualifications. They, like their parents, end up in low-paid jobs. As a result, when they have children, they, like their parents, can't afford to take a vacation during school holidays and so the cycle continues.

The people in the area where I live, do not seem to have linked a good education with a well-paid job. To most people, this is an obvious link to make, but not in these parts. It's very odd.

What is also odd is that they have traits which are a tad odd to say the least. Rather than reducing their outgoings, they maximise them. For example, they get their telephone and broadband services from BT rather than from one of the cheaper suppliers. Likewise with their gas and electricity. Their electricity is purchased from one of the big six, and more expensive, suppliers and their gas is supplied by British Gas, which has to be the most expensive supplier in the market. Their food is often home delivered by Sainsburys, rather than taking a trip to Aldi or Lidl.

What's really odd is that, rather than buying a brand new modest Dacia, they buy huge top of the range Honda or Toyota SUVs that are 10+ years old and, because they get such poor deals, end up paying far more than they would if they bought a new Dacia.

I'm sure that there's method in their madness but, er, no I'm not.

The result of this is that they are in much debt.

As I said earlier, people are sometimes their own worst enemy.

What I also understand is that a lot of drinking and drug taking goes on in these parts, although much is 'covert'. The suicide rate is also one of the highest in the country.

Do I sound like a fuckin' people person?
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Old 11-29-2019, 10:36 AM   #22
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Sounds better than the US. Here you can have a low-paid job and make all the best money decisions and you still won't make it. And if you get sick, you could lose everything even if you thought you were doing well.
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Old 12-03-2019, 02:23 PM   #23
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Could do with some help if you could, please. My wife and I will be in San Francisco over the Christmas/New Year period. What kind of weather should we expect?
It'll be cold, of course. Below 65F is cold, to me. It might be rainy. I don't live in Frisco, I'm about 400 miles south of there. Probably not that different from England (I'm thinking that that is your location?). Is does get good and foggy there, as well.
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Old 12-03-2019, 02:50 PM   #24
hertz vanrental
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It'll be cold, of course. Below 65F is cold, to me. It might be rainy. I don't live in Frisco, I'm about 400 miles south of there. Probably not that different from England (I'm thinking that that is your location?). Is does get good and foggy there, as well.
Thanks for the info. Much appreciated. Sounds a blast. Yes, am in the UK. Sunday, the temperature was 19F. Even now, it's only 39F.

65F is positively balmy.

Do I sound like a fuckin' people person?
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