A message to Theists

zdave · 03-03-2011, 12:05 AM

Also known as "Non-sequitur: A love story"

Dear Theist,

We have a lot to talk about, you and I. Nothing more pressing than the schism created between us by that juggernaut of a thought exercise, religion. Once and for all, I really do wish that not just you, but all of your fellow theists will understand this one implacable point:

You're getting ahead of yourselves.

I think it's a fine thing to have a belief in something, and I'll be there right next to you defending your right to hold said belief. But, the problem is this incessant arguing that has squandered any chance of you and I becoming friends.

You see, the arguments presented in favor of God have the same, tired old boring problem of leading evidence to a point, rather than following evidence to where it goes. It's like trying to follow the car behind you...

Get behind the evidence and look forward, instead of having a belief and then laboriously dragging the evidence to it, this is not how we advance any knowledge about reality.

By the very method you're employing in your arguments, I could postulate that any supernatural thing exists... any one of them, including things that I just made up. See reason for what it is, and stop ignoring the counter-arguments when they're presented to you.

I've been correcting arguments from theists for nigh on 20 years without anything remotely interesting being brought into the fray. It's just the same old dried up problem of leading evidence to a point, but packaged in myriad ways.

Thanks,
zdave

Smellyoldgit · 03-03-2011, 01:08 AM

Fuck off, you irritating retarded twats. Keep your shit to yourself.

Stargazer · 03-03-2011, 04:12 AM

P.S. Don't assault me in public with your beliefs, and stop knocking on my door. No solicitors DOES mean you.

It is not your job to monitor what I believe or don't believe.

Also, keep in mind that there is a difference between listening and just waiting for your turn to talk.

West491 · 03-03-2011, 05:15 AM

I would love to see a theist's letter to atheists.

Sternwallow · 03-03-2011, 06:17 AM

Few of them have enough wit to write anything but tracts.

ILOVEJESUS · 03-04-2011, 03:57 AM

I always state that I wish to meet God in person as I have a number of grieviences that need to be dealt with before I can reinstate my Christian faith. If he cannot be bothered to see me, then I can't be bothered to share the faith.AMEN BROTHER.

Qlidnaque · 03-06-2011, 01:51 AM

Quote:

ILOVEJESUS wrote

I always state that I wish to meet God in person as I have a number of grieviences that need to be dealt with before I can reinstate my Christian faith. If he cannot be bothered to see me, then I can't be bothered to share the faith.AMEN BROTHER.

ya, me too. If I ever meet God, I have a number of serious questions and conversations to be had with him before I decide to share any positive relationship with him/her in the future. If god exists, he/she's a twat.

erich von stalhein · 03-11-2011, 05:23 AM

Hi zdave

I was just pottering around the internet and came across your post, and I thought you sounded like a decent and courteous sort of guy, so I joined up just to say hi!

You see, I am a theist, and I thought at least one theist should read your message, and let you know it had been read. I'm sorry you find "the arguments presented in favor of God have the same, tired old boring problem", because no-one wants to be bored. I wouldn't dream for trying any on you because I don't want to bore you, and I certainly don't want to have to put you to the trouble of "correcting" me. But those same old arguments seem to me to be very powerful - it's strange how different people see things so differently, isn't it?

But I have to disagree with you on one thing - I don't think "We have a lot to talk about, you and I." I have read your message, and you don't want to hear any more boring old arguments from me - there doesn't seem to be anything more to be said, does there?

But like I said, you seem like a pretty decent guy, and I just wanted to say I commiserated with you. Hope things are going well with you. See you later!

ILOVEJESUS · 03-11-2011, 05:57 AM

Thanks for that Erich It is amazing how many people are happy believing in fairies. You seem like a pretty decent guy though.....

Sternwallow · 03-11-2011, 06:48 AM

Erich, I think the reason zdave seems not to want conversation is not because the old arguments are boring, but that they have been destroyed in the marketplace of ideas and he, and I, are hoping for, nay longing for, any really new argument with original supporting logic.

Your post has a conciliatory tone that is welcome, but we have seen it from theists before and it almost every time, declined into strident aggressive condescension as we rehearsed the now-standard responses to common theist illogic and irrationality.

Fair warning, if you do sink into a bellicose preaching mode or quote the Bible at us as though it was evidence of something, you will get extremely impolite responses, likely including a great deal of what you will find discourteous language in the extreme.

So, welcome to the very aptly named "Raving Atheists Forum".

West491 · 03-11-2011, 12:26 PM

Quote:

erich von stalhein wrote

But those same old arguments seem to me to be very powerful - it's strange how different people see things so differently, isn't it?

Which argument do you mean? How and why do you find it to be "powerful"?

And welcome to the forum.

erich von stalhein · 03-11-2011, 02:11 PM

Quote:

ILOVEJESUS wrote

Thanks for that Erich It is amazing how many people are happy believing in fairies. You seem like a pretty decent guy though.....

Thanks, I think I am a pretty decent guy - at least my late mother used to love me!

(At least, that's what she said.)

Never met anyone who believed in fairies, at least not older than about 5, but the world is a funny place.

Thanks for saying g'day.

nkb · 03-11-2011, 03:10 PM

Quote:

erich von stalhein wrote

Never met anyone who believed in fairies, at least not older than about 5, but the world is a funny place.

There are billions that believe in fairies. They just give their fairies names other than Tinkerbell.

Sternwallow · 03-11-2011, 06:07 PM

Quote:

erich von stalhein wrote

Never met anyone who believed in fairies, at least not older than about 5, but the world is a funny place.

People who believe in fairies after age 5 are also funny in a rather sad way.

zdave · 03-11-2011, 06:28 PM

Quote:

erich von stalhein wrote

Hi zdave

I was just pottering around the internet and came across your post, and I thought you sounded like a decent and courteous sort of guy, so I joined up just to say hi!

You see, I am a theist, and I thought at least one theist should read your message, and let you know it had been read. I'm sorry you find "the arguments presented in favor of God have the same, tired old boring problem", because no-one wants to be bored. I wouldn't dream for trying any on you because I don't want to bore you, and I certainly don't want to have to put you to the trouble of "correcting" me. But those same old arguments seem to me to be very powerful - it's strange how different people see things so differently, isn't it?

But I have to disagree with you on one thing - I don't think "We have a lot to talk about, you and I." I have read your message, and you don't want to hear any more boring old arguments from me - there doesn't seem to be anything more to be said, does there?

But like I said, you seem like a pretty decent guy, and I just wanted to say I commiserated with you. Hope things are going well with you. See you later!

Thanks Erich,

I'm more than happy to share a chat with you regarding your beliefs and such, what Stern said earlier, the arguments have mostly been previously destroyed. However, if you don't care about whether or not what you believe is true, then I would not care to chat with you, as you would then have no method of changing your mind.

To put it in perspective, I'm willing to change my mind if the evidence points to the contrary... are you capable to claiming the same thing? If so, great... let's discuss your arguments, and destroy them for you.

Again, thanks for popping in and reading my message.