Movie: 300 ...spoilers abound but don't really matter

I saw this a couple days ago and my boyfriend is still bitching about it being Conservative propaganda (or at least jerk-off material). I thought it was too but disregarded the fact and enjoyed the film regardless. Hey, I don't get to brutally kill people in real life, I might as well enjoy it on screen...and mel gibson isn't in it!

Certainly there are nasty parallels that could be drawn:
- The enemy is a mob of 'soulless' Persians
- The Spartans refer to fighting for "freedom" ad nausea
- the queen of Sparta at one point actually outright says "freedom isn't free"
- espousing the values of "reason" while belonging to basically a death-cult
- dying for your country is the best thing you could possibly do
- there's a whole "army of one" theme (read: don't deviate, don't think for yourself)
- as well as a "we don't need allies" thing.
- intellectualism is belittled as weak (as shown by references to Athenians)
- the insane Persian 'god-king' Xerxes attacks solely to acquire the king's obeisance (read: Islam)
- he's also quite effeminate and never himself fights
- there's totally a 9/11-reference scene near the beginning where the bodies of an entire town are found pegged to a tree...them damn soulless Immortals!
- our hero king Leonidas kills people basically because he wants to and against the rule of law (messengers are protected by the gods remember!)
- invokes law only when convenient
- Spartans are a military culture (what's the annual military budget for the US? pre-war even!)
- While the 300 are awesomely kicking ass elsewhere, the Spartan government refuses to send more troops because the king entered the war illegally.
- main opponent in the debate is evil, is silenced not with argument or evidence but with a knife, is found to be a traitor! (wow, it's like the perfect liberal strawman and exactly what neo cons would like to do to him!)
- actually, every single spartan that disagrees with the king turns out to be a traitor!
- They only die because a quasimoto betrays them (don't be different!)
- Only one of the 300 survive...and he looks kindof like chuck norris.



Reasons I maybe don't give a shit:
- the spartans are actually attacked by a real enemy numbering somewhere close to a million on their own land!
- bush, er, Leonidas actually leads his fucking 300 into war
- he actually had a plan...and it's a sassily good one
- the priests are portrayed as perverted and corrupt inbred monsters (teeheehee)
- it's like watching a long game FMV...mmm, can't wait for God of War II

anyway, I still liked the film mostly because I could filter out the crap while I was watching it...hell I'd still recommend seeing it, just be warned you may be surrounded by 16-24 year olds who watch wrestling.

[Kamikaze189]

Once I walked out of the movie, I thought briefly about if there was some Iraq commentary in there.

I had to dismiss it, though, for the reason that they were actually being attacked in the movie. And the "freedom" they were protecting was their form of government, which was already established, unlike Iraq where they had nothing we really wanted to protect.

If anyone I ever argued with started using this as an analogy, I would simply explain the above, and why it is a false comparison.

One thing I really did like though, was that they used the word "reason" more than they used the words "god" or "gods," and that they were fighting a guy who thought he was god, and basically owned him.

Edit: 300th post in a thread about 300. :cool:

[JU Mike]

darwinfish wrote

Hey, I don't get to brutally kill people in real life...

Why, what's holding you back? I mean don't get me wrong, I think an axe would look good on you.

Souds like they took a few liberties with the story.

darwinfish wrote

as well as a "we don't need allies" thing.

According to Herotodus, the Greek army at Thermopylae was comprised of:

Spartans 300
Mantineans 500
Tegeans 500
Arcadian Orchomenos 120
Other Arcadians 1,000
Corinthians 400
Phlians 200
Mycenaeans 80
Thespians 700
Thebans 400
Phocians 1,000
Opuntian Locrians 13

darwinfish wrote

there's totally a 9/11-reference scene near the beginning where the bodies of an entire town are found pegged to a tree...them damn soulless Immortals!

Herodotus wrote

The Aeginetan trireme, of which Asonides was captain, did however give them some trouble. On board this ship was Pytheas son of Ischenous, who acted heroically on that day. When his ship had been taken, he would not stop fighting until he had been entirely hacked to mincemeat. When he finally did fall, he still had life in him, and the Persian soldiers on the ships took great pains to keep him alive for his valor, tending his wounds with ointments and wrapping him in bandages of linen cloth. Upon returning to their own station, they showed him to the whole host, and made much of him and treated him with kindness.

The Persians were apparently known for their kindness in war, though Xerxes was the exception so it's possible he might order a town destroyed.

darwinfish wrote

our hero king Leonidas kills people basically because he wants to and against the rule of law (messengers are protected by the gods remember!)

Wikipedia wrote

...the Persians entered the pass and sent a mounted scout to reconnoiter. The Greeks allowed him to come up to the camp, observe them, and depart. When the scout reported to Xerxes I the size of the Greek force and that the Spartans were indulging in calisthenics and combing their long hair, Xerxes I found the reports laughable. Seeking the counsel of an exiled Spartan king in his employ, Demaratus, Xerxes I was told that the Spartans were preparing for battle and that it was their custom to adorn their hair beforehand. The exile called them "the bravest men in Greece" and warned the Great King that they intended to dispute the pass.

darwinfish wrote

While the 300 are awesomely kicking ass elsewhere, the Spartan government refuses to send more troops because the king entered the war illegally.

Herodotus wrote

The force with Leonidas was sent forward by the Spartans in advance of their main body, that the sight of them might encourage the allies to fight, and hinder them from going over to the Medes, as was likely they might have done had they seen that Sparta was backward. They intended presently, when they had celebrated the Carneian Festival, which was what now kept them at home, to leave a garrison in Sparta, and hasten in full force to join the army. The rest of the allies intended to act similarly; for it happened that the Olympic Festival fell exactly at this same period. None of them looked to see the contest at Thermopylae decided so speedily; wherefore they were content to send forward a mere advance guard. Such accordingly were the intentions of the allies.

the whole fucking thing glorifies war. Just watching the trailer pissed me off. It's a great recruiting tool for sure.

Spartan King Leonidas: This is where we fight! This is where they die!
Captain: On these shields, boys!
[Spartans cheer]
Spartan King Leonidas: Remember this day, men, for it will be yours for all time.
Persian Officer: SPARTANS! Lay down your weapons!
Spartan King Leonidas: Persians...COME AND GET THEM!
Spartan King Leonidas: We're in for one wild night.
Spartan King Leonidas: Give them nothing! But take from them everything!
Spartan King Leonidas: Spartans! Enjoy your breakfast, for tonight we dine in Hell!
Stelios: Then we will fight in the shade.
Spartan King Leonidas: A new age has come, an age of freedom. And all will know that 300 Spartans gave their last breath to defend it.
Spartan King Leonidas: This is where we fight. This is where they die.
Xerxes: Cruel Leonidas demanded that you stand. I require only that you kneel.
Persian Officer: Spartans, lay down your weapons.
Spartan King Leonidas: Come and get them!


lets kill until we die, YAAAYYYY!!!
I would let my little boy watch a porno before I would let him watch that crap.
the special effects aren't really that important to me.

Whatever happened to just enjoying a kickass action movie?

As for me, I'll probably see it this weekend.

[Professor Chaos]

I just think the movie looks shitty, based on the trailers. It appears that the producers of the movie wanted to play with their special effects toys, and after they were done they asked the janitor to write a script to go around it.

Apparently the Iranians are upset with the movie.




DH went and watched it, but I'll wait for it on video...solely for the eye candy. Hopefully they include in the extras all the workouts the guys did to get in shape. I saw a bit of it on tv and I wanted to lick the sweat from their bodies.

[calpurnpiso]

Professor Chaos wrote

I just think the movie looks shitty, based on the trailers. It appears that the producers of the movie wanted to play with their special effects toys, and after they were done they asked the janitor to write a script to go around it.

I feel exactly as you do. I'm not going to waste my money. I'll wait till it is release on DVD.

[anthonyjfuchs]

Um...you know that a DVD costs about twice as much as a movie ticket, right?

[Professor Chaos]

anthonyjfuchs wrote

Um...you know that a DVD costs about twice as much as a movie ticket, right?

A DVD rental? ;)

[calpurnpiso]

The MOST IMPORTANT thing of it all was omitted. The fierce spartans were a GAY BUNCH. This omission is a SHAME since it contributes to the IGNORANCE of our youth and also DISTORTS the truth of history. The piece of Christ-psychosis infected shit ignorant general Peter Pace doesn't even KNOW Spartans were gay. This is due to constant MISINFORMATION by Christ-psychosis infected people.

[calpurnpiso]

anthonyjfuchs wrote

Um...you know that a DVD costs about twice as much as a movie ticket, right?

not a rental. I'll NEVER buy a movie like that.

JU Mike wrote

Why, what's holding you back? I mean don't get me wrong, I think an axe would look good on you.

why, are you keeping the katanas for yourself?

Evil_Mage_Ra wrote

Whatever happened to just enjoying a kickass action movie?

I enjoy a kickass action movie as much as the next guy, but I don't think it has to be so over the top pro war to be a great action flick.

All of those 'going into battle' quotes that make it sound honorable to kill or die in war are just stupid to me. For one thing, NOBODY talks like that going into battle. EVERYBODY is scared to mutherfucking death and very quiet. If they have all of those great special effects, why can't they make it realistic and really show the horrors of battle instead of making it look like an exciting video game.

To me, a good war movie is one that shows just how fucking awful it really can be. I bet Saving Private Ryan didn't make anybody want to go enlist.