Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-03-2005, 12:41 PM   #1
psyadam
Senior Member
 
psyadam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 835
this is the athiests only thread all you thiests stay out (don't post).

I'll begin the discussion. We can talk about anything but I would like to start by asking why everyone here is athiest. Here is what I think:

1. Like Kai Nielsen, I believe that the concept of "God" is unintelligible, at least from the standpoint that "omnipotence" and "omniscence" and "omnibenevolence" are unintelligible concepts

i) "omnipotence" If God was really omnipotent, he should be able to do the logically impossible and also be able to limit his own power, both of which are contradictory

ii) "omniscense" God should know exactly everything we are going to do at every nanosecond of every day which implies that we really have no agency which implies that nothing that we do really matters or has any moral implications

iii) "omnibenevolence" A half-way benevolent God would not allow for the grotesque amount of evil in this world. There is no theodicy that can explain the torture of innocent children. Also, an omnibenevolent God would be hopelessly boring, because such a God would be perfectly predictible, always picking the correct moral choice, and as such would be like a robot having no personality.

2. The way Christians act is prudential, arrogant, and immoral (to say the least).
Example1: "God doesn't answer your prayers because you are a fag"
Example2: "Freedom aint free"
psyadam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-03-2005, 03:52 PM   #2
a different tim
Obsessed Member
 
a different tim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Oxford, UK.
Posts: 2,330
OK...I'll bite.

I'm not an atheist for either of these reasons. If Christians act immorally, I think we have to own up to Stalin ourselves. And I'm never happy about a priori logical arguments without reference to empirical evidence. Which leads me neatly into why I'm an atheist.......

So I'm what I've been calling on the threads a "weak atheist" or an "epistemological atheist" or an "invisible pink unicorn" atheist. It's up to the proposers to prove God exists, and the logical default assumption is that he doesn't. Anthony Flew called this "the presumption of atheism" by analogy with the presumption of innocence. It's an epistemological position - it's saying not "there is no God" but "there is no reason to suppose there is a God, any more than there is a reason to suppose there are invisible pink unicorns" (I used to use invisible rhinos for this argument, in honour of Bertrand Russell who used a rhino in a similar argument with Wittgenstein, but everyone on this site seems familiar with IPUs and the FSM, so I'll stick to them here I guess).

Now although it's "weak" in that it doesn't insist on the definite non existence of God, I've always felt it to be philosophically the stronger position. I work from epistemology - the study of how we know things, and to me statements we make are always statements about what we know. So how we know things reliably is the start point. It's fundamental. All the theist assertions regarding God fall at this first hurdle. They all assume that not only is there a God but that their "knowledge" of Him is reliable. And since they have no methodology to speak of, they're wrong.

There are many ways to be an atheist...... :)

"You care for nothing but shooting, dogs and rat-catching, and will be a disgrace to yourself and all your family"
a different tim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-03-2005, 04:28 PM   #3
Down21
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
I'm an atheist because I am content with Natural selection as the reason for my existence.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-03-2005, 04:57 PM   #4
jp2211
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
For me, it's obvious that the whole god idea is a product of intellectual and moral laziness. It's just a placebo answer for people who don't want to think about anything deeply.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-03-2005, 07:04 PM   #5
benjaminbp18
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Humans have no credible evidence or convincing proof of any deities, including a God, Creator, First Cause, Perfect or Necessary Being. Simple :)

Other reasons such as the ones you provided are simply addendums to this primary one. (for me)
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2005, 10:52 PM   #6
vheltrite
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
am an atheist.....
to me its obvious that there is no such thing as god......
for me being theist is like being immature..... i dont believe in such leap of faith.....
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2005, 10:59 PM   #7
lesserpanda
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
I'm an atheist because I apply the same criteria to god as I do to everything else in the universe. If there's no evidence for it, it isn't there.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2005, 03:39 AM   #8
vheltrite
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
to all atheist here like me.....
are you all open to ideas like....
the jesus exsisted long ago just came from the future.... lol....
just asking guys...... lol.....
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-09-2005, 10:04 AM   #9
Sauron
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
I know that there's no god because I haven't won the stupid Powerball jackpot yet!
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-09-2005, 10:21 AM   #10
The Judge
Obsessed Member
 
The Judge's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: U.K. London
Posts: 1,987
Since you asked...My reasons are personal. It involves a very painful loss of faith from a devoutly religious childhood and adolescence. Before any armchair psychologist theists make the assumption that my atheistic ravings are a projection of anger at a lost father figure or what ever, I would like to cut them off at the pass and hold my hands up to freely admit that my early hatred of "god" was powerful and indeed a driving force behind my raving. However, this painful passage has given way to a new search for meaning and an intellectual journey unparralelled in insight that any theistic religion could have ever given me. I now function from a more enlightened perspective of relevatism and epiricism.

Invisibility and nothingness look an awful lot alike.
The Judge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-09-2005, 11:03 AM   #11
inkadu
Obsessed Member
 
inkadu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Inklandia
Posts: 3,389
Quote:
The Judge wrote
Since you asked...My reasons are personal. It involves a very painful loss of faith from a devoutly religious childhood and adolescence. Before any armchair psychologist theists make the assumption that my atheistic ravings are a projection of anger at a lost father figure or what ever, I would like to cut them off at the pass and hold my hands up to freely admit that my early hatred of "god" was powerful and indeed a driving force behind my raving. However, this painful passage has given way to a new search for meaning and an intellectual journey unparralelled in insight that any theistic religion could have ever given me. I now function from a more enlightened perspective of relevatism and epiricism.
Cool.

Emotions play a part in everything we do. Doesn't invalidate what we're passionate about, though.

If religion were based on facts, it would be called science, and no one would believe it. -- Stephen Colbert
inkadu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2005, 08:39 PM   #12
God, my arse
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Atheism makes sense, religion doesn't. It contradicts itself at most times and has massive gaps. And it's a waste of time believing in something that anybody could have made up. oh yeah and because if you try and ask a religious person about an irregularity in their scriptures they just say, "don't question the lords will...", "that is how it is..." I mean what the hell kind of answers are those? and that's why I am an Atheist. ^.^
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2005, 09:10 PM   #13
calpurnpiso
I Live Here
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Chandler- Arizona
Posts: 14,227
One can view religious beliefs simple as a neurological problem, just like headaches. ..but headaches are warnings. They are, like it is pain, idiot warning lights in our brains!! So, if we let our brains start to believe, or accept, incredibly irrational fairy tales ( that no mentally healthy person would accept as fact) as if they were true and real, then we are having a great headache ( a neurological problem beggining to form). Ultimately religious-psychosis can make the person committ suicide ( doe , Jones, Koresh etc) and make women drown their children...:)

Christians and other folks infected with delusional beliefs think and reason like schizophrenics or temporal lobe epileptics. Their morality is dictated by an invisible friend called Jesus.
calpurnpiso is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2005, 10:13 PM   #14
antix
Obsessed Member
 
antix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: inside a hill
Posts: 2,910
Most of my unanswered questions about god growing up did little at the time. I accepted the "faith" issue because I was terrified of gowing to hell. Then I started to think about the concept of heaven and hell, aka, eternity. The thought that eternity in all of its glory/anguish are determined by the decisions I make in a few short years of life on Earth-- and other's eterinity could be decided upon less than 1 second of life-- was utterly absurd. If that were the case, then life on Earth would be pointless by comparisson. Of course, now I have many more reasons for being an atheist, and every day I gain even more-- by coming to TRA :)
antix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2005, 06:48 AM   #15
Rat Bastard
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
ADT said "I think we have to own up to Stalin ourselves. "

I disagree, big fella. Just as no xtian should have to own up to Hitler, etc. We in the current era need accept no responsibility for sins past. No atheist in this forum for instance, even existed (well, maybe a couple) during Stalin's lifetime. I personally believe in personal accountability. Stalin and his followers committed the atrocities, so they should get the rap.
  Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 03:27 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin - Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2000 - , Raving Atheists [dot] com frequency-supranational frequency-supranational