Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-19-2011, 01:29 AM   #1
TheJackel
Member
 
TheJackel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Boston
Posts: 78
Cosmological Reasons For Gods Nonexistence:

COSMOLOGICAL REASONS FOR GODS NONEXISTENCE:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6w2M50_Xdk

** Before you read the reply: Watch the video, and note where it states that when you know enough science, you can look back at the Universe and say "Dude I am you!" **

---------------------

I will make this argument very simple.. Consciousness can't exist at "Ground State" in the Physical world... And consciousness can not exist in an immaterial world because immaterial is the absents of substance. AKA "NOTHING".. To say something is made of literal nothing is utterly retarded. Theists thus like to argue for the "Nothing GOD". And they wonder why it can't be seen .. However, I will take this even a step further and tackle the entire argument with just the use of information theory:

Information: The Material Physical Cause of Causation:


Just so people know, this follows information Entropy, Pantheism, and the understanding that energy =/= information. Two sides of the same coin to where neither can exist without the other. This also follows the conservation of energy where energy and mass can neither be created or destroyed. So under information theory, this statement is said to be unarguably true:

Quote:
Nothing begins with consciousness, and everything begins and ends with information
So why is information considered =/= with energy? Well, here is why, there are 3 fundamental laws that govern cause and effect, information, and energy. These same 3 laws, principles, or attributes govern consciousness, morals, ethics, laws, emotions, and feelings, or any Complex Adaptive system with feedback. So what are they?

* POSITIVE
* NEGATIVE
* NEUTRAL


These are not only the base laws of existence, they are the attributes to everything, and everything we know of is made of energy. thus it's considered under information theory that Energy =/= information as both substance and value (as previously noted above). Thus the 3 fundamental properties, attributes, and laws are the cause of all causation. Information and energy are thus simply stated as "Cause".

There can only ever be a positive, negative, or neutral;

Action
Reaction
Process
Mathematical equation
Answer
Choice
Decision
Intent
Purpose
Moral
Ethic
Emotion
Feeling
Piece of information
State
Function
Ability
Response
System
Feedback
Opinion
Phenomenon
Condition
Ability
Power
Electric Charge
Selection
Adaptation
Mutation
Transformation
Position
Point of view
Observation
Sensation
Perception
Or the relativity of anything above

-----------------

So Let's look at why this argument is key to addressing the "Christian GOD":

We can just take a moment to address the Fount of Knowledge:
St John of Damascus, The Fount of Knowledge:

Abstract 1:

Quote:
"The uncreate, the unoriginate, the immortal, the bound- less, the eternal, the immaterial, the good, the creative, the just, the enlightening, the unchangeable, the passionless, the uncircumscribed, the uncontained, the unlimited, the indefi- nable, the invisible, the inconceivable, the wanting nothing, the having absolute power and authority, the life-giving, the almighty, the infinitely powerful, the sanctifying and com- municating, the containing and sustaining all things, and the providing for all all these and the like He possesses by His nature. They are not received from any other source; on the contrary, it is His nature that communicates all good to His own creatures in accordance with the capacity of each."


Abstract 2:


Quote:
"And yet again, there is His knowing of all things by a simple act of knowing. And there is His distinctly seeing with His divine, all-seeing, and immaterial eye all things at once"
  1. Boundless
  2. Uncontained
  3. Unlimited
  4. Omnipresent
  5. The containing and sustaining of all things
  6. Omniscient
  7. Immaterial
Thus it can be said that such an argument self-collapses in every area of the supposed attributes given when anyone of them is taken out of the equation by another conflicting attribute, or thing (such as ourselves). Especially in the case or state of absolute Omniscience. So here is what it boils down to under information theory:


Quote:
* I = reference to all the information that gives I an Identity. It's the entire essences of "I am".
So let's see where this entire GOD concept completely falls apart. Especially when concerning "Omniscience".

1) A boundless GOD? Can a boundless GOD be boundless if you are to claim all of us to separate individuals? What boundaries lie between GOD being me, and not being me?

2) If he is uncontained then what separates him from me?

3) If he's without limits, what limits define GOD apart from who I am?..

4) If he is omnipresent, where do I exist?

5) If he contains and sustains all things, would he not be existence itself? Thus am I, and everyone else here not the conscious representations of god, or GOD himself?

6) If he is Omniscient and knows infinitely everything to which is knowable, would he not know me in every infinitely knowable way to where he himself would literally be I, me, or who I am in every infinitely knowable way?

7) If he is immaterial, would he not be made of nothing? Thus how does nothing exist as a person, place, or thing? How does nothing as a substance be the property value of something? How does nothing contain and sustain informational value?

--------------------


"Pantheism":

This is where it get's interesting in regards to the posted video and science. Pantheism may sound religious, but it's really just saying that we are obvious made from, and apart of the natural world, or reality.. And it doesn't matter what form, place, or state that might be in. But I take it more in regards to Materialism as a realist point of view.

Quote:
Pantheism is the view that the Universe (Nature) and God are identical.[1] Pantheists thus do not believe in a personal, anthropomorphic or creator god.
The Christian GOD concept can only ever at best describe existence itself as a whole. We may as well be worshiping ourselves! Even solipsism will fail under information theory because consciousness can not exist without cause! Consciousness can not exist without first a base of inquiry that can support it. Thus consciousness requires information, with a system to which has feedback in order to achieve a function of observation.

* The Brain is both a Neurocomputer and a Quantum Computer


* Conscious Mechanical Self-Organization

Abstract:
Quote:
The evolution of consciousness is seen in the context of energy driven evolution in general, where energy and information are understood as two sides of the same coin. From this perspective consciousness is viewed as an ecological system in which streams of cognitive, perceptual, and emotional information form a rich complex of interactions, analogous to the interactive metabolism of a living cell. The result is an organic, self-generating, or autopoietic, system, continuously in the act of creating itself. Evidence suggests that this process is chaotic, or at least chaotic-like, and capable of assuming a number of distinct states best understood as chaotic attractors
End Part 1:

Last edited by Smellyoldgit; 03-19-2011 at 02:23 AM. Reason: typos corrected - by request
TheJackel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2011, 02:02 AM   #2
TheJackel
Member
 
TheJackel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Boston
Posts: 78
Part 2:

Conclusion:
---------------

Recap:
Quote:
Consciousness can not exist without first a base of inquiry that can support it. Thus consciousness requires information, with a system to which has feedback in order to achieve a function of observation.
A: There can be no choice, or decision made without information
B: There can be no consciousness or awareness without information
C: One can not have knowledge without information
D: One can not do anything without information
E: One can not exist without informational value
F: One can not think without information
G: One can not even know one's self exists without information
H: One can not reply, respond, or react without information
I: One can not convey, send, or express a message without information
J: There can be no morals, ethics, or laws without information
K: One can not have or express emotions, or feelings without information
L: One can not have experiences, or experience anything at all without information
M: One can not have a place to exist in order to be existent without information
N: One can not Create, or Design anything without information
O: One can not have the ability to process things without information
P: Intelligence can not exist without information to apply
Q: No system, or process can exist without information
R: Cause and effect can not exist without information



Existence is seen as a phenomenal reality of physical self-oscillating, self-organizing energy that makes you, me, the stars, matter, anything with mass possible. What this show's is very simple:


Quote:
Energy =/= information--> Self-Oscillation --> Self-Organization (Order from Chaos) ---> to self-direction --> primitive self-cognitive dynamics --> cognitive self-direction --> to awareness --> eventually to the possibility of reaching a complex conscious state.
TheJackel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2011, 02:05 AM   #3
TheJackel
Member
 
TheJackel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Boston
Posts: 78
So let me know what you think .. Yes it is very long, and I apologize for it's length . However, I think it's worth the read!

Typo corrections (of Part 1):

Quote:
** Before you read the reply: Watch the video, and note where it states: "when you know enough science, you can look back at the Universe and say, Dude I am you!" **
Quote:
And consciousness can not exist in an immaterial world because immaterial is the absents of substance. AKA "NOTHING"..
TheJackel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2011, 02:10 AM   #4
Smellyoldgit
Stinkin' Mod
 
Smellyoldgit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Britland
Posts: 13,532
Needs pictures - but I corrected your typo.

Stop the Holy See men!
Smellyoldgit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2011, 02:27 AM   #5
ghoulslime
I Live Here
 
ghoulslime's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 20,921
But there could be Leprechauns, right? Because I have faith in Them!

The Leprechauns do not forbid the drawing of Their images, as long as we color within the lines. ~ Ghoulslime H Christ, Prophet, Seer, Revelator, and Masturbator
ghoulslime is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2011, 02:36 AM   #6
TheJackel
Member
 
TheJackel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Boston
Posts: 78
Smellyoldgit,

Thank you .. It's like 4am so it doesn't surprise me that I have made so many errors lol. I appreciate your help in correcting them
TheJackel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2011, 02:39 AM   #7
TheJackel
Member
 
TheJackel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Boston
Posts: 78
Quote:
ghoulslime wrote View Post
But there could be Leprechauns, right? Because I have faith in Them!
I don't see why Leprechauns can't exist.. After all, that's how I became a GOD.

http://thinkingaloudforum.com/forum/...art=60#p433777



Quote:
As I was preparing my delightful Irish bowl of Lucky Charms when I noticed this little Leprechaun that appeared to have been in the Great Pixie World War. His injuries spilling the luck that had brought him to my attention. I found that he was unable to move or escape my grasp! Realizing time was not to be wasted, I hastily evoked the the rule of granting me my three wishes for his capture! Granted I was of my 3 wishes just moments before his final breaths of luck would run out! For I wished he be granted a full recovery so he can grant me remaining 2 wishes! I then granted me captured leprechaun the power to grant me my remaining 1 wish. Oh how he grind at me with his lucky smile as he tinkled in his new found power to grant me my final wish to be an all powerful GOD of existence! With a sparkle, a pop, and a flash of Golden light, I have become the all Lucky and powerful GOD!

Thus with my new powers, I vanquish all those unlucky Pixies into Pixie Dust bunnies!

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_DVWeRwaKTdo/S ... unny+2.jpg

THE END!

PS

I just created an eternal supply of Lucky Charms
TheJackel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2011, 03:13 AM   #8
TheJackel
Member
 
TheJackel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Boston
Posts: 78
Quote:
Needs pictures,
Perhaps you can help me hunt some down .. I will have to look for some later on

So I am the Protector of the Dead, Fore I am your guide through the Underworld on your way to Osiris. I call myself the Jackal!, a "Fierce Protector" and Guardian of Sacred Esoteric Mysteries!
TheJackel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2011, 05:15 AM   #9
ghoulslime
I Live Here
 
ghoulslime's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 20,921
Quote:
TheJackel wrote View Post
I don't see why Leprechauns can't exist.. After all, that's how I became a GOD.

http://thinkingaloudforum.com/forum/...art=60#p433777

Wow! God, is that really you?

I think I might owe you money, dude. I was meaning to pay you. I was just waiting for you to show up.

The Leprechauns do not forbid the drawing of Their images, as long as we color within the lines. ~ Ghoulslime H Christ, Prophet, Seer, Revelator, and Masturbator
ghoulslime is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2011, 06:35 AM   #10
Kinich Ahau
Obsessed Member
 
Kinich Ahau's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Great Ocean Road
Posts: 2,899
So Anubis was the one true god all along?

Once you are dead, you are nothing. Graffito, Pompeii
Kinich Ahau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2011, 11:23 AM   #11
Eva
Super Moderator
 
Eva's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Puerto Rico
Posts: 9,775
what's a jackel?

One of the most irrational of all the conventions of modern society is the one to the effect that religious opinions should be respected....That they should have this immunity is an outrage. There is nothing in religious ideas, as a class, to lift them above other ideas. On the contrary, they are always dubious and often quite silly.
H. L. Mencken
Eva is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2011, 01:18 PM   #12
Smellyoldgit
Stinkin' Mod
 
Smellyoldgit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Britland
Posts: 13,532
Prolly another typo?

Stop the Holy See men!
Smellyoldgit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2011, 06:15 PM   #13
Sol
Senior Member
 
Sol's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Scotland
Posts: 813
I think its something you wear to keep small change and your collection of pens in and rain out.

Professor Plum - In the Dinning Room - with the Lead Pipe...
Sol is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2011, 08:22 PM   #14
Kinich Ahau
Obsessed Member
 
Kinich Ahau's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Great Ocean Road
Posts: 2,899
Quote:
Eva wrote View Post
what's a jackel?
He mite be a bad spellar

Once you are dead, you are nothing. Graffito, Pompeii
Kinich Ahau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2011, 08:58 PM   #15
ghoulslime
I Live Here
 
ghoulslime's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 20,921
Quote:
Sol wrote View Post
I think its something you wear to keep small change and your collection of pens in and rain out.
I think I know a guy who hangs out around our local elementary school wearing one of those. I noticed the penis pen is in his coat.

The Leprechauns do not forbid the drawing of Their images, as long as we color within the lines. ~ Ghoulslime H Christ, Prophet, Seer, Revelator, and Masturbator
ghoulslime is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 09:35 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin - Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2000 - , Raving Atheists [dot] com frequency-supranational frequency-supranational